Is QoS not meant to work perfectly?

Report issues relating to bandwith monitoring, bandwidth quotas or QoS in this forum.

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pkm
Posts: 106
Joined: Sat Aug 22, 2015 4:49 am

Re: Is QoS not meant to work perfectly?

Post by pkm »

Volaris wrote:Have you guys tried adding a class to prioritize packets under 512 bytes in size to reduce ping/bufferbloat? See imgur link in my signature below.
Ah yes i have that rule in my setup. Doesn't seem to help much in keeping pings low though. I tried putting it at the top of the list and at bottom but doesn't seem to make a difference.

However you only got 2 classes and none have minimize RTT? Not sure if thats an ideal setup for 3Mbps/4Mbps speeds. No gaming classes with minimum speed set doesn't sound good, as well as no specific rules to prioritize gaming traffic.

greyfreak19
Posts: 39
Joined: Sun Nov 22, 2015 11:12 am

Re: Is QoS not meant to work perfectly?

Post by greyfreak19 »

i have set the percent BW but it should't make a huge diffrence i will test tough

i did have that rule to prioratize small packets it definetly helped and lower bufferbloat is always good i guess

the thing is the ping rises i dont just see them ingame i see them in the ACC of Gargoyle aswell to my default gateway i was like mayby its just he gateway but it affects my games to so it cant be that aswell as if i download torrents everything is fine if i download anything else ACC works fine but if i download from steam my speed goes from ~3800kbps to <2500kbps sometimes even <1500kbps and this is constant it pretty much happens everytime idk could be my ISP or my DSL Copper Cable

Volaris
Posts: 177
Joined: Thu May 01, 2014 1:02 pm

Re: Is QoS not meant to work perfectly?

Post by Volaris »

pkm wrote:
Volaris wrote:Have you guys tried adding a class to prioritize packets under 512 bytes in size to reduce ping/bufferbloat? See imgur link in my signature below.
Ah yes i have that rule in my setup. Doesn't seem to help much in keeping pings low though. I tried putting it at the top of the list and at bottom but doesn't seem to make a difference.

However you only got 2 classes and none have minimize RTT? Not sure if thats an ideal setup for 3Mbps/4Mbps speeds. No gaming classes with minimum speed set doesn't sound good, as well as no specific rules to prioritize gaming traffic.
Not necessary on my connection since at most there's 3 devices online and Gargoyle's built in equal bandwidth sharing divides my 12/1 connection equally if needed. Pings never go above 20s ms unless there's like 200+ torrent connections hammering the router.
greyfreak19 wrote:i have set the percent BW but it should't make a huge diffrence i will test tough

i did have that rule to prioratize small packets it definetly helped and lower bufferbloat is always good i guess

the thing is the ping rises i dont just see them ingame i see them in the ACC of Gargoyle aswell to my default gateway i was like mayby its just he gateway but it affects my games to so it cant be that aswell as if i download torrents everything is fine if i download anything else ACC works fine but if i download from steam my speed goes from ~3800kbps to <2500kbps sometimes even <1500kbps and this is constant it pretty much happens everytime idk could be my ISP or my DSL Copper Cable
ACC might be being too aggressive if it's cutting your speeds that much. You could either try turning off minRTT or disabling ACC if that doesn't help. Sometimes changing the ACC ping target to something like Google or OpenDNS (8.8.8.8 or 208.67.222.222) can also help. Just have to tinker and see what works best for your connection since they're all different.
QoS Tip: Don't complicate your QoS settings. Gargoyle evenly splits available bandwidth between active devices as needed. Just delete all your classification rules and leave only one normal service class and you're done. No more arguing over bandwidth.

greyfreak19
Posts: 39
Joined: Sun Nov 22, 2015 11:12 am

Re: Is QoS not meant to work perfectly?

Post by greyfreak19 »

no i don't think it's ACC cuz even when it lowers my speed to 1500kbps while downloading something from steam if i play a game it will have major spikes when compared to downloading a torrent with it lower it to 3400-3600kbps which is normal sometimes higher it might be just be my line but its in fine condition so im really puzzled here also the ping spikes in ACC for a few seconds not jsut in game from 20-40ms to 150+ms then back and it dosen't happen randomly if i open 4Tabs while downloading a torrent the ping in ACC will spike above 100+ms until the tabs load can a bad or old modem cause this i have a modem/router from my ISP its pretty shitty and old but its in bridge mode so idk still it's wieard to me torrents don't cause a much of a problem as one measly steam download even if i limit it to 50% of my total bandwith from inside steam itself

pkm
Posts: 106
Joined: Sat Aug 22, 2015 4:49 am

Re: Is QoS not meant to work perfectly?

Post by pkm »

Volaris wrote:
pkm wrote:
Volaris wrote:Have you guys tried adding a class to prioritize packets under 512 bytes in size to reduce ping/bufferbloat? See imgur link in my signature below.
Ah yes i have that rule in my setup. Doesn't seem to help much in keeping pings low though. I tried putting it at the top of the list and at bottom but doesn't seem to make a difference.

However you only got 2 classes and none have minimize RTT? Not sure if thats an ideal setup for 3Mbps/4Mbps speeds. No gaming classes with minimum speed set doesn't sound good, as well as no specific rules to prioritize gaming traffic.
Not necessary on my connection since at most there's 3 devices online and Gargoyle's built in equal bandwidth sharing divides my 12/1 connection equally if needed. Pings never go above 20s ms unless there's like 200+ torrent connections hammering the router.
greyfreak19 wrote:i have set the percent BW but it should't make a huge diffrence i will test tough

i did have that rule to prioratize small packets it definetly helped and lower bufferbloat is always good i guess

the thing is the ping rises i dont just see them ingame i see them in the ACC of Gargoyle aswell to my default gateway i was like mayby its just he gateway but it affects my games to so it cant be that aswell as if i download torrents everything is fine if i download anything else ACC works fine but if i download from steam my speed goes from ~3800kbps to <2500kbps sometimes even <1500kbps and this is constant it pretty much happens everytime idk could be my ISP or my DSL Copper Cable
ACC might be being too aggressive if it's cutting your speeds that much. You could either try turning off minRTT or disabling ACC if that doesn't help. Sometimes changing the ACC ping target to something like Google or OpenDNS (8.8.8.8 or 208.67.222.222) can also help. Just have to tinker and see what works best for your connection since they're all different.

You really cant compare 12Mbit to 3Mbit lol

pkm
Posts: 106
Joined: Sat Aug 22, 2015 4:49 am

Re: Is QoS not meant to work perfectly?

Post by pkm »

Lantis wrote:Slow connection + limits of what gargoyle can do

With a bit more bandwidth to use I think you would see a vast improvement.
Even with my rule setup, and 18mbps, if I am playing a game at 11ms latency and I purposely saturate the connection, it will initially spike to ~80-100 before settling to about 40-50.
I was thinking, would something more powerful like an archer C7 help in my case? Though my current router don't seem to be hitting max load when the line is in use. If thats the case i wouldn't see an improvement?

ispyisail
Moderator
Posts: 5194
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Location: New Zealand

Re: Is QoS not meant to work perfectly?

Post by ispyisail »

I was thinking, would something more powerful like an archer C7 help in my case? Though my current router don't seem to be hitting max load when the line is in use. If thats the case i wouldn't see an improvement?
I think its a bit of a cat and mouse game.

Internet gets faster then you need a faster router. Faster wireless speeds come along then you need a new router. Router too fast then you need to upgrade your internet speed etc etc

Your internet speed should be matched to your router speed.

Suspect your bottleneck is you internet speed?

pkm
Posts: 106
Joined: Sat Aug 22, 2015 4:49 am

Re: Is QoS not meant to work perfectly?

Post by pkm »

ispyisail wrote:
I was thinking, would something more powerful like an archer C7 help in my case? Though my current router don't seem to be hitting max load when the line is in use. If thats the case i wouldn't see an improvement?
I think its a bit of a cat and mouse game.

Internet gets faster then you need a faster router. Faster wireless speeds come along then you need a new router. Router too fast then you need to upgrade your internet speed etc etc

Your internet speed should be matched to your router speed.

Suspect your bottleneck is you internet speed?

Yeah... i guess you're right... there is just no way around this slow internet speed :(

Also, do the QoS rules override the gargoyles IP bandwidth sharing system? Sometimes even the min BW doesnt seem to work. I set 1800kbps for twitch but traffic from other service classes seem to get the priority which i suspect is because of the ip bandwidth sharing at work.

pkm
Posts: 106
Joined: Sat Aug 22, 2015 4:49 am

Re: Is QoS not meant to work perfectly?

Post by pkm »

http://imgur.com/lXpWOpp

You can see here, despite twitch having a 1800kbps min BW requirement it doesn't seem to work well. Ive also tried giving twitch 90 percent BW but it seems like something is just overriding these settings. The IP bandwidth sharing, im thinking.

Lantis
Moderator
Posts: 6920
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2015 5:33 am
Location: Australia

Re: Is QoS not meant to work perfectly?

Post by Lantis »

Those limits will only start to enforce if twitch requests that much bandwidth and the connection is saturated.

You're chasing your tail.

QOS isn't a miracle worker.

Your internet connection is the issue here in my opinion.
https://lantisproject.com/downloads/gargoylebuilds for the latest releases
Please be respectful when posting. I do this in my free time on a volunteer basis.

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