Please help with QoS

[VitaminBeer]

Hi there,

I know this might sound like a bit of a newb question, well to be honest it is. I got this netgear router so I could setup quotas and that was it, but after general reading around I've found that I may like to use the QoS feature as well like I used to do in my Billion 7800N.
Unfortunately for me, it is nothing like that and I've spent a couple of hours reading and trying to work out the best way to setup the QoS with Gargoyle, any thoughts or tips would be very much appreciated. So far this is what I have come up with. (I think i've kinda stuffed it all up now though)

I have 4 house members including myself, we all have multiple devices and we all do a range of downloading, p2p, usenet, gaming and youtubing face booking and the whole bit.
I have a PS3 and a couple of Wii's and I want them to always be going fast so there's no high ping business

There is 2 quota's, it's my wife and myself in one and my brother and his partner in another halving our download amount per couple's.

So I have created 4 classes each with 25% but now I am not sure what to do next, or if this is even the best way to do it.

I have looked at creating a rule, how do I define the devices into the classes? What happens when a PC is also a gaming device along with the PS3?

Also with the default service class, what am I supposed to put for this or should I have a 5th class for rules or IP's that do not sit in the proper classes? If so what % should I give it?

Basically what I was hoping for is a guide and some screen shots as to what would be the best way to do this. I can't seem to make sense of the wiki tutorial and yes I've read it more than once.

I am using version 1.4.7

Any help is much appreciated thanks

Kind Regards,

Brady

[VitaminBeer]

Ok I've scraped the idea of having 4 classes with 25% each because I was not sure what to do from here on.

So I have reverted back to the way it was before lucky I took some notes before I wrote over it.

I have ACCC enabled and my Upload speed is 95% of my real upload speed

This is what I've got so far with these screen shots

Please feel free to chime in

I have only done the PS3 so far, and that is 192.168.1.103

My problem now lies with my brother's PC as he uses his to play games as well as download crazy, so I'm thinking for him I may have to use the port numbers instead and place them under the gaming class, can anyone out there confirm if this is the right way to go?

I still am not sure how the default setup works properly

I've set the default class to normal

I've also got to work out how to set my brother's p2p downloads to go onto the slow class, i'm guessing again with a port number but what if he uses a random number every time he starts up utorrent? what am I supposed to do then without placing his whole IP under the slow class


In the upload section I've pretty much made it the same as the download one not sure if this is right either, I basically changed the VoIP to be gaming instead.

Am I on the right track here?

[tals]

OK a couple of things

QoS feature as well like I used to do in my Billion 7800N.

I hope not, the 7800N's QOS doesn't work that well, I used to have one of these and it caused me untold misery in terms of the QOS.

Probably easier if I just explain how I set mine up then work out if additional is needed.

I have 5 classes setup for simplicity

Mummy, Daddy, Daughter,Son and Other

I then assign each of the person's devices (by using IP address) to their appropriate class and those not fitting the above or additional go to other class.

Now what this means for me is no one person on the network can unduly affect the others. For instance if my son is streaming the latest video then I can game, my daughter can stream etc. I have the % set at 20% (connection is between 3mb-6mb). Now another aspect you may not appretiate if just myself and my daughter are on it doesn't restrict us to 20% (like the billion) it gives us 50% each and if it was just me then 100%.

Now if you want to get cleverer and start breaking down by port you will need another class so you have say a brother fast and brother slow. With the brother slow being all the download ports etc and the fast being others. You could do this by having the ports listed first in the rules and then the IP as a catch all afterwards. Personally I think this is too OTT. If all the items are in the same class then they won't benefit from the QOS i.e the example of your brother wanting qos and to download. Though QOS does ensure the line doesn't get congested.

Do use status->connection list to check the items are being allocated to the correct rules.

Another advantage of the above is I can see for instance how much my daughter is using on the network or any member of the family

Apologies for not directly answering the question and others maybe able to directly answer but my own view is this is the easiest way to get QOS working for groups, then focus on the clever bits later if that is still a requirement

p.s I would upgrade your firmware to 1.5.4 unless their was a reason you didn't do this

[pbix]

Given that you are new to this I suggest you start simple and improve as you learn. First upgrade to v1.5.4 and then enable the default QoS setup after entering the appropriate download and upload speeds. Finally enable the ACC.

If you do just this your bandwidth will split equally by IP addresses. Since normally one person will only be using one IP address at a time it will be a good start. Once we get this working and you understand how it works you can start to enhance the setup to include your gaming requirements. Read the QoS Wiki and then think about what you want.

Your situation seems well suited to QoS but I cannot understand what you hope to accomplish with Quotas. Unless you have a specific need for quotas it would best to not confuse the issue by using them.

If a computer is used both for gaming and other activities it will be necessary to study which ports are being used by the games. We use steam here at my house and it uses ports 25000-28000 and the UDP protocol. Not sure what you are using but you will have to do some research.

[VitaminBeer]

Thank you so much guys

Alright I will follow the idea of upgrading to the newer firmware when there is no one home as I do not want to disrupt everyone's service. My only problem here is all the work I've put into setting up the Quotas will go out the window and I will need time to redo all this.

I use quotas because we have limited amount of bandwidth per month here, ie 500GB and I split it for my wife and myself and then for my brother and his partner, so we end up with 250GB each and we split the bill down the middle, it seemed like a good idea and is why i went through all the trouble to get gargoyle on a roll in the first place. After our 250GB is exceeded we are dropped down to 256KB/Sec (according to our ISP when we reach 500GB total we are dropped to 256KB/Sec) (Although Quotas is another subject I thought I would point out that although my Brother may meet his quota for the month before I do he is essentially eating away at my 250GB of 'fast' speeds, not sure if there is anything I can do about this).

I will upgrade the firmware some time soon and reset all my IP's for the Quota's and then I will come back and try the group's, I like the idea of being able to see who is doing what.

I assume that each person would get now 20% because there is a 5th class that is 'Other' which would need it's own amount of bandwidth.

Thanks again for your input I will get back to you very soon about what I do and how I do it and will post some more screen shots.

I have looked in the Connections List and I can now confirm that the PS3 is working on the 'Gaming' setup as it should at fast speeds with a minimum bandwidth of 50KB/Sec.

Cheers

Brady,

[VitaminBeer]

OK a couple of things

I have 5 classes setup for simplicity

Mummy, Daddy, Daughter,Son and Other

I then assign each of the person's devices (by using IP address) to their appropriate class and those not fitting the above or additional go to other class.
- Do you put this in the Destination IP for the Download QoS and then do you do the exact same setup for the Upload QoS but use Source for the IP instead?



p.s I would upgrade your firmware to 1.5.4 unless their was a reason you didn't do this
---- No I don't think so, but I do think I tried it but I cannot remember why I went back, I have been unnerved of stability issues

[VitaminBeer]

Okay I know this is a little off topic but the Wireless speed is not as fast when using Version 1.5.4 - In SSIDer it shows that the dBm is lower and I can input that in as a custom field for what the old firmware was but is this safe to do so? Is there a reason it is now 35 and not 17?
I also notice that the 2.4Ghz band is now not doing dual band, ie it stays on channel 1 and does not cover channel 1 to 6 or whatever it was doing before

I believe this is why I went back to the older firmware I can't quiet remember.

Either way everyone went out while I quickly changed over the firmware and put everyones IP's in setup the qouta's again, even though it's stuffed up now because the billing month is on the 4th and it's been reset already. So will just have to guess for the rest of the month. All should be good for next month though.

So now I have the default QoS on both Up and Down with the correct speeds input in both but for the Up it's only 95% of the actual real up speed. I have ACC on and that about sums it up, nothing else has been done as of yet. Everyone is back now so I can't really muck around with it anymore at this stage.

I'm not sure if I should tinker with making the classes per person because of the complex variety of devices that are across the network. Is it just going to be easier to make a 'gaming' class and add my PS3 and my brother's Game ports to this, it kind of makes sense, and then make the minimum speed on it like 50kb/sec or something.

Oh I feel like pulling my hair out over this, I always have liked to do things the hard way, I know that once it's setup perfectly it will be great and I will know the in's and out's of what to do to make it work correctly it just takes time to absorb the wiki because there is so many bloody settings

I'll add more thoughts as I go

[VitaminBeer]

Okay the PS3 is not going under the Gaming Class as it should

Not sure why

[VitaminBeer]

could only add 3 pics heres the 4th

[pbix]

Looks like you have been busy with Gargoyle.

On the upload QoS screen you should use source IP and destination ports in this case. Think of how the data flows from the source IP (local computer) to the destination port on the remote computer on the upload side of things.

On the download screen you should reverse and use dest IP and source port. You have this wrong which is why your PS2 is not classifying correctly.

So now we have everyone being treated equally with the exception of the special treatment for the two gaming machines. BTW, only the gaming class should have the MinRTT item checked.

Make a System->Backup of your settings so you can get back to this point quickly if you need to.

I agree that QoS and router setup in general can be complex. Be patient grasshopper and learn. The good news it that Gargoyle can do what you need like no other router software can.

We will improve step by step and not piss everyone in the house off as we do.

Before we go into Quotas and more QoS rules tell me what your router model number is. Lets talk about your WAN link. Is it PPPoE over ADSL link. It would be best that the Billion be in "Pure bridge mode" which turns it into a dumb modem. Also Wifi on the Billion should be off, LAN DHCP should be on and the subnet of the Modem LAN connection should be different than your Gargoyle LAN. Trust me when I tell you that there is nothing the Billion software can bring to the table. It will only get in our way. Do you know how to make the above changes?

Also how is the ACC behaving under load? Post a screen shot of that section.