Partition number (if applicable)

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stuartbh
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Joined: Sun Oct 20, 2019 4:18 pm

Partition number (if applicable)

Post by stuartbh »

Gargoylers,

In such instances as where a router (such as Linksys and perhaps others) have multiple partitions upon which firmware could be installed, would it be possible to show which partition is the active partition on one of the router's pages, such as under device info on the status page (hint: using /usr/sbin/fw_printenv -n boot_part output)?

Thank you.
Very Respectfully,

Stuart, N3GWG
Computer Scientist

RomanHK
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Re: Partition number (if applicable)

Post by RomanHK »

I see it as unnecessary functionality through the GUI, not to mention that if you want to change the partition, you still need to use the command line. Normally the user shouldn't get to it, but it's my assumption, I don't know how developers will look at it.

The OEM firmware does not have such information either.
Turris Omnia with OpenWrt 21.02 - Tested
Linksys WRT3200ACM with Gargoyle 1.13.x
TL-WR1043ND v2 with Gargoyle 1.10.0

http://gargoyle.romanhk.cz custom builds by gargoyle users

Lantis
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Location: Australia

Re: Partition number (if applicable)

Post by Lantis »

I agree with Roman.
Much like upstream OpenWrt, this is better suited as an optional plugin.

I will build this when I find time.
http://lantisproject.com/downloads/gargoyle_ispyisail.php for the latest releases
Please be respectful when posting. I do this in my free time on a volunteer basis.

stuartbh
Posts: 76
Joined: Sun Oct 20, 2019 4:18 pm

Re: Partition number (if applicable)

Post by stuartbh »

Lantis wrote:I agree with Roman.
Much like upstream OpenWrt, this is better suited as an optional plugin.

I will build this when I find time.
Thank you!

Having that as an option for Gargoyle would be very nice.

I have to admit, I do not really understand what the dividing line is between what you (or those that you agree with) feel ought be in the code base and what ought be a plugin. I am curious, honestly.

Now, in pursuance of exposing my thinking on the subject and as well your edification, I figure that knowing which partition one is currently using could be important at installation time (prior to the installation of plugins), and this was my reasoning for asserting that it ought be placed into the code base.

However, the foregoing notwithstanding, I also have to admit that I am far more predisposed to assuring that everyone is properly thanked for implementing it.

Thus, thanks again!
Very Respectfully,

Stuart, N3GWG
Computer Scientist

ispyisail
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Re: Partition number (if applicable)

Post by ispyisail »

It's an evolution

In the beginning there was only one router and everything was built into the firmware. Then we added features but ran out of flash space. Different routers different flash size.

The way forward is plug-ins you choose what you want.

Lantis
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Location: Australia

Re: Partition number (if applicable)

Post by Lantis »

The mantra or mission statement for Gargoyle is a simple to use, easy to configure front end interface to Openwrt, with some extra features like bandwidth monitoring etc.

For the average home user, partition number means nothing and isn't something they need to focus on. It only raises confusion.

For an advanced user, it may be useful for them.
I can tell you that personally i've never bothered switching partitions or knowing what partition i'm on. Unless something goes catastrophically wrong, it's just not needed. And if it goes catastrophically wrong, the chances that the web interface is up and running to tell you which partition you're on is slim to none.

So:
  • Might cause confusion
  • Not needed for all routers
  • Rarely used or niche usage
Ticking those 3 boxes makes me think Plugin straight away.
http://lantisproject.com/downloads/gargoyle_ispyisail.php for the latest releases
Please be respectful when posting. I do this in my free time on a volunteer basis.

stuartbh
Posts: 76
Joined: Sun Oct 20, 2019 4:18 pm

Re: Partition number (if applicable)

Post by stuartbh »

ispyisail wrote:It's an evolution

In the beginning there was only one router and everything was built into the firmware. Then we added features but ran out of flash space. Different routers different flash size.

The way forward is plug-ins you choose what you want.
Well, I can't imagine such an option increases the firmware size by all that much; however, I surely do understand the requisite for keeping the firmware small enough to fit in most modern routers. Moreover, the installation of plugins on Gargoyle is really very easy to do.

It is instructive that I read that the OpenWRT project is stating that in succession to calendar year 2019 and OpenWRT version 19.07, "no further OpenWrt images will be built for 4/32".

Now therefore, this raises a new question...is the policy of the Gargoyle project going to follow the same upstream policy or will the Gargoyle project start provisioning a fork that is newer than 19.07 (though feature depleted) to continue supporting such older routers?

My own personal outlook is rather simple, at a certain point the Linux kernel dropped support for 386 machines and the current kernel will not run thereupon. You just can't support old hardware forever.
Very Respectfully,

Stuart, N3GWG
Computer Scientist

stuartbh
Posts: 76
Joined: Sun Oct 20, 2019 4:18 pm

Re: Partition number (if applicable)

Post by stuartbh »

Lantis wrote:The mantra or mission statement for Gargoyle is a simple to use, easy to configure front end interface to Openwrt, with some extra features like bandwidth monitoring etc.

For the average home user, partition number means nothing and isn't something they need to focus on. It only raises confusion.

For an advanced user, it may be useful for them.
I can tell you that personally i've never bothered switching partitions or knowing what partition i'm on. Unless something goes catastrophically wrong, it's just not needed. And if it goes catastrophically wrong, the chances that the web interface is up and running to tell you which partition you're on is slim to none.

So:
  • Might cause confusion
  • Not needed for all routers
  • Rarely used or niche usage
Ticking those 3 boxes makes me think Plugin straight away.
You had me laughing quite hard! "For the average home user"? I rather doubt the "the average home user" is changing their firmware to a customized Linux distribution! But, if it gives you pleasure to believe it, so be it. There are egyptologists that believe the sarcophagi in the Serapeum were made with hand tools (hammers and chisels) despite their being less then 5/1000ths of an inch of deviation on the flatness of the surfaces and corners. My answer is, yeah right, but, I surely respect your right to an opinion (despite my agreement or not).

By the way, I do agree it is of niche usage (as most routers do not a support multiple partitions), and that it is not needed for all routers, but, causing confusion? The GPL license itself is more likely to confuse "the average home user" more than a small section of text consisting of one word and one number! Don't get me wrong, I am sure not suggesting that the level of complication associated with the GPL is any reason to stop updating and distributing software subject to that license (just because "the average home user" might not understand it). The partition number could be explained in a paragraph or less. But again, in substance, I am not at all adversarial to it being a plug in.
Very Respectfully,

Stuart, N3GWG
Computer Scientist

Lantis
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Location: Australia

Re: Partition number (if applicable)

Post by Lantis »

What do you hope to gain from having it visible to you?
http://lantisproject.com/downloads/gargoyle_ispyisail.php for the latest releases
Please be respectful when posting. I do this in my free time on a volunteer basis.

stuartbh
Posts: 76
Joined: Sun Oct 20, 2019 4:18 pm

Re: Partition number (if applicable)

Post by stuartbh »

Lantis wrote:What do you hope to gain from having it visible to you?
When one uses a router that has multiple partitions and you are lets say reverting it to another copy of the firmware (say having Gargoyle on both partitions), it would be handy to know quickly before logging on which partition you are on authoritatively (especially if you are facing problems with a configuration or the like).

Let me state that while my router is now running Gargoyle fine, it would be nice to have an option to see that. Again, I have no problem with it being a plugin, that's fine (one of my partitions would work I am sure, so if I know which one I am on I know which I will be on when I re-upgrade it). It's just an idea for a convenience I thought of as I did run into the issue of not being sure before.

Thank you for your interest in it.
Very Respectfully,

Stuart, N3GWG
Computer Scientist

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